[Blabber] Hackable guns

Mark Phelan phelanm at gmail.com
Sat May 11 02:11:17 UTC 2013


21st century culture:
 http://www.alternet.org/nra-convention-sells-ex-girlfriend-target-bleeds-when-you-shoot-it

On Fri, May 10, 2013 at 7:12 PM, Ben S <ben.sugimori at gmail.com> wrote:
> The blue and pink goo will save us!
>
> BenS
>
> On May 10, 2013, at 18:13, <fractal at maui.net> wrote:
>
> When 3d printing evolves according to Moores Law, over time, true nano will
> be born. I'm guessing fifty years tops.
> At that point we're opening apolyptic seals big time... (wit. The "grey goo
> theory")
> As such, some kind of framework will have to be established to handle folks
> who want to stray into the grey goo zone...
>
> davesky
>
>
>
> From: Ben S <ben.sugimori at gmail.com>
> To: Hack Manhattan! <blabber at list.hackmanhattan.com>
> Subject: Re: [Blabber] Hackable guns
> Date: Fri, 10 May 2013 18:04:25 -0400
>
> Are you proposing licensing 3D printers? That'll never fly! The culture of
> Open Source/DIY's ethos is in direct conflict with such government
> oversight.
>
> Assholes will always find new ways of hurting innocent people - nobody can
> anticipate all the potential scenarios.
>
> On the flip side, paranoid folks worrying about The Man taking away their
> Freedoms really see the government in a much more flattering light than is
> appropriate. Incompetence is a much more worrisome problem there.
>
> Teaching wood shop and mechanics in public schools doesn't implicitly lead
> to kids guillotining their teachers. Sure, It's Possible, but it's certainly
> not an epidemic.
>
> This 3D printing thing's in the same club as the Cotton Gin, the Printing
> Press, and the Internet: a few hiccups are to be expected at first, but it's
> not breaking The Seven Seals of The Apocalypse. It's just change.... As
> usual.
>
> BenS
>
> On May 10, 2013, at 17:06, Matt Joyce <matt at nycresistor.com> wrote:
>
> I don't see this as being vastly different from ancient sumeria developing
> the code of hamurabi.
>
> The reality is, if you are going to go around offering to build houses for
> people, you are going to be held accountable for killing people when they
> fall down.
>
> if you are going to be going to own a chemical assembly plant... you are
> going to be held accountable for what you produce.
>
> In modern times that means being licensed and regulated.  Nothing wrong with
> that as long as accessibility is merit based rather than financial.
>
> -Matt
>
>
> On Fri, May 10, 2013 at 1:53 PM, <fractal at maui.net> wrote:
>
> this is the first thread ive established that's actually fun to read!
>
> --- ben.sugimori at gmail.com wrote:
>
> From: Ben S <ben.sugimori at gmail.com>
> To: Hack Manhattan! <blabber at list.hackmanhattan.com>
> Subject: Re: [Blabber] Hackable guns
> Date: Thu, 9 May 2013 12:12:54 -0400
>
> Might want to qualify the term, "libertarian," when self-applied - Mussolini
> could fit a broad-stroke interpretation of that term.
>
> I prefer Leonard Cohen's statement of political conviction, "when it all
> comes down to dust, I will kill you if I must; I will help you if I can/and
> when it all comes down to dust, I will help you if I must; I will kill you
> if I can."
>
> The constitution was written a long time ago. It isn't shabby for something
> written when Everything was Completely Different, but yeah: Change is always
> accompanied by violent birth pains.
>
> The sky ain't falling yet, though.
>
> BenS
>
> On May 9, 2013, at 12:01, <fractal at maui.net> wrote:
>
> I'm a libertarian at heart wrt freedom to put chems into ones own body, but
> of course when the lab-on-a-chip comes to fruition, there will be no end to
> the hue and cry, and the laws will probably become completely distopian...
> These concepts are completely beyond typical 20th century thinking, and
> the constitution wasn't even designed to handle this sort of freedom. This
> may finally determine if man's big brain is really worth all the nerve
> cells...
>
> --- ben.sugimori at gmail.com wrote:
>
> From: Ben S <ben.sugimori at gmail.com>
> To: Hack Manhattan! <blabber at list.hackmanhattan.com>
> Subject: Re: [Blabber] Hackable guns
> Date: Thu, 9 May 2013 11:54:23 -0400
>
> "Ice Nine" will finally be realized!
>
> BenS
>
> On May 9, 2013, at 11:50, <fractal at maui.net> wrote:
>
> Wait until the genetic research guys in Sandy Eggo start making cheap chem
> labs on a chip... Instant crack, LSD, heroin, just add water! The weapon
> thing is just the tip of the ice-berg (heh heh). Look up companies like
> Affymetrics...
>
> --- ben.sugimori at gmail.com wrote:
>
> From: Ben S <ben.sugimori at gmail.com>
> To: Hack Manhattan! <blabber at list.hackmanhattan.com>
> Subject: Re: [Blabber] Hackable guns
> Date: Wed, 8 May 2013 15:50:24 -0400
>
> You should tell your teachers that (insert homework subject here) leads to
> guns getting made - odds are, it has as much to do with them as does 3D
> printing!
>
> 3D printed fighter jets Are real, however. Lockheed Martin has a
> top-of-any-conceivable-line setup, to print in titanium and stealth
> composites.
>
> THAT's what they should freak out about - folks flying around in their own
> personal fighter jets!
>
> I mean, if it's even remotely possible, it's a safe bet that teenagers are
> doing it; so it's perfectly sane to freak the Hell out before considering
> what it would realistically take to accomplish any of this.
>
> Can I fly your 3D printed Stealth Bomber this weekend? I know you've got
> your own personal 3D-printed Area 51, and the aliens have taught you how to
> make WMDs, after all.... ;-)
>
> BenS
>
> On May 8, 2013, at 15:26, Matthew Duepner <matthewduepner14 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> This whole thing is  ridiculous.   I had just gotten in the elevator when
> the head of my school mentioned 3D printed guns.
>
> On May 8, 2013 11:48 AM, <fractal at maui.net> wrote:
>
> I'm no expert. Weapons can be plastic, however.  Some rpg and surface-to-air
> missile launchers are plastic, and in fact, are made by Mattel
>
> --- ben.sugimori at gmail.com wrote:
>
> From: Ben S <ben.sugimori at gmail.com>
> To: "Hack Manhattan!" <blabber at list.hackmanhattan.com>
> Subject: Re: [Blabber] Hackable guns
> Date: Wed, 8 May 2013 11:44:43 -0400
>
> And what undetectable ammo, rifled barrel, cooling system, spent brass
> ejection, etc. would work with it?
>
> Without a rifled steel barrel, you'd have an ALREADY notoriously inaccurate
> gun shoot even Less accurately, while disintegrating or exploding in your
> hand.
>
> How about the bulge of a huge, impractical submachine pistol in your
> clothing/luggage?
>
> A full-auto would mean repeated contained explosions. Could any 3D printing
> that isn't ridiculously out of reach handle such repeated structural stress
> and intense heat?
>
> Guns are heavy for a reason.
>
> BenS
>
> On May 8, 2013 11:28 AM, <fractal at maui.net> wrote:
>
>
> I'm not debating the resiliency of litho resin.  Here's the thing:
> 1:   Print out uzi kit
> 2:   Produce casting dies
> 3:   Reproduce parts with delrin or other heavy duty plastic
> 4:   Instant undetectable weapon
> --- guan at yang.dk wrote:
>
>
>
> From: Guan Yang <guan at yang.dk>
> To: Hack Manhattan! <blabber at list.hackmanhattan.com>
> Subject: Re: [Blabber] Hackable guns
> Date: Tue, 7 May 2013 14:39:32 -0400
>
> Exactly. I think all the people printing guns are basically a PR stunt right
> now. How many times would you want to fire a printed gun? How close would
> you want to stand when it fires?
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 14:38 , Matthew Duepner wrote:
>
>> I agree. It sounds stupid unless you are suicidal or are trying to prove a
>> point.
>> On May 7, 2013 2:36 PM, "Matt Joyce" <matt at nycresistor.com
>> (mailto:matt at nycresistor.com)> wrote:
>> > easier to make a gun on a lathe.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Tue, May 7, 2013 at 11:35 AM, <fractal at maui.net
>> > (mailto:fractal at maui.net)> wrote:
>> > > Speaking of hacking and machines, how about the new trend of using
>> > > stereolithography to print out guns and other weapons?
>> > >
>> > > Do you think there could be a legal backlash in the works? (think meth
>> > > lab vs allergy pills)
>> > >
>> > > Davesky
>> > >
>> > >
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